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Where Are the Young Men? - 2/17/2010 4:29:58 PM
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Fritzpw_Admin
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quote:
News Note: Where Are the Young Men?
Albert Mohler - Author, Speaker, President of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary
A visit to your local college or university campus is likely to reveal that a revolution has taken place. On many campuses, young women now outnumber young men, and a gender gap of momentous importance is staring us in the face.
This gender gap has been growing for some time now, as successive generations of young women have entered the world of higher education. Yet, no one seemed to see a gap of this magnitude coming -- until it had already happened.
The disparity of enrollment by gender varies by institution, but it is now estimated that almost 60% of all undergraduate students enrolled in American colleges and universities are women. This represents something altogether new in human experience since the rise of the university model as the dominant learning environment for young adults. For the first time, a generation of young women will be markedly more educated than their male generational cohort.
Is this a bad thing . . . a negative development? Yes -- and profoundly so. The problem is not the larger enrollment of young women in colleges and universities. The problem is the phenomenon of missing young men, whose absence spells big trouble for the future.
The numbers point to the problem, but do not explain it. Explanations for the phenomenon of missing young men point to the fact that girls outperform boys at every level in grades K-12, and are thus more ready for the college experience than the boys. Other factors include economic and cultural patterns. Among some ethnic groups, the disparity between men and women entering college is far greater than 60% to 40%. Many young men consider the educational environment to be frustrating, constricting, and overly feminized. Others have lost confidence that an undergraduate education will lead to a job with adequate income and stability. Whatever the reason, their absence makes a big difference on the college campus today -- and will make an even bigger difference in the larger society in years ahead.
Read the rest of News Note: Where Are the Young Men?
This is an interesting issue... the absence of guys heading to college.
How do you think this will impact the work place in the next decade or longer?
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 2/17/2010 11:39:45 PM
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Tarox
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hate to say it, but its the effect of feminism gone wild.
Men are told by society that they're dumb, incompetent, and the best thing they can do to make their lives easier is to submit to the women in their lives.
I don't know how it will impact the workplace... I think generally women can do the things men can do.
I think men as a whole stepping back from responsibilities and opportunities will continue to affect the family the most.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 2/18/2010 3:32:44 AM
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carebearstare
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whoa, i think maybe we should put the brakes on the immediate fingerpointing in that way towards the overall evil feminism of society. some comment on the actual article page was heading down the same tracks.
pinpointing actual reasons and not just tossing blame around OR mistaking correlation for causation is really difficult, even for people who analyze society/economy/etc for a living.
i'm not advocating just smiling blithely and saying 'well what is is and is probably supergreat' i'm just saying who knows, its probably a combination of things.
maybe it does have to do with women having something to prove (whether it is in their minds, really present in society, whatever). maybe there's a man-culture component of don't be such a square and quit studying and worrying over stupid grades bc its girly (maybe girls are freer to care about it?), maybe it's a man-culture thing that if the girls are beating us, then i'm done with this, who needs it, or maybe theres a component of affirmative action residuals in a way (girls werent allowed, now they are, schools probably got their bias on for a number of years to get the 50/50 ratio they wanted so that they would look good, now the pendulum has gone the other way and has to settle). i dunno. maybe it's none of these and theres some other reason.
i get it, there's hyperfeminism out there and lots of manhating, but i really don't think that society at large things guys are stupid and should be trodden under. at all. just my two cents i guess. my major is way away from this kind of stuff...
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 2/18/2010 8:55:31 AM
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BelleWeather
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Fritzpw_Admin
quote:
News Note: Where Are the Young Men?
Albert Mohler - Author, Speaker, President of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary
A visit to your local college or university campus is likely to reveal that a revolution has taken place. On many campuses, young women now outnumber young men, and a gender gap of momentous importance is staring us in the face.
This gender gap has been growing for some time now, as successive generations of young women have entered the world of higher education. Yet, no one seemed to see a gap of this magnitude coming -- until it had already happened.
The disparity of enrollment by gender varies by institution, but it is now estimated that almost 60% of all undergraduate students enrolled in American colleges and universities are women. This represents something altogether new in human experience since the rise of the university model as the dominant learning environment for young adults. For the first time, a generation of young women will be markedly more educated than their male generational cohort.
Is this a bad thing . . . a negative development? Yes -- and profoundly so. The problem is not the larger enrollment of young women in colleges and universities. The problem is the phenomenon of missing young men, whose absence spells big trouble for the future.
The numbers point to the problem, but do not explain it. Explanations for the phenomenon of missing young men point to the fact that girls outperform boys at every level in grades K-12, and are thus more ready for the college experience than the boys. Other factors include economic and cultural patterns. Among some ethnic groups, the disparity between men and women entering college is far greater than 60% to 40%. Many young men consider the educational environment to be frustrating, constricting, and overly feminized. Others have lost confidence that an undergraduate education will lead to a job with adequate income and stability. Whatever the reason, their absence makes a big difference on the college campus today -- and will make an even bigger difference in the larger society in years ahead.
Read the rest of News Note: Where Are the Young Men?
This is an interesting issue... the absence of guys heading to college.
How do you think this will impact the work place in the next decade or longer?
When the disparity was morementhanwomen in the college population, were any of you wringing your hands at that inconsistency in the school populations.
No. That inequity was seen as perfectly in balance with societal and cultural mores.
If young men are now not able to qualify for college entrance, is it necessary to pull the boogieman out of the closet and flog the feminization of educational systems? If that theory had any teeth, why the push for SAHM's to homeschool? Won't those mother's automatically feminize their student children by the very nature of their gender?
If more women are attending college, it is more likely in pursuit future economic opportunities--same as young men--and the competition and qualifications have become more demanding.
Perhaps taking personal responsibility for not "making the cut" would be the first order of business, instead of blaming a gender for failure to gain placement in college.
_____________________________
What lies behind us and what lies before us
are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 2/18/2010 9:41:33 AM
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thebaker
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i know in several communities boys are either being killed prior to college or ending up in prison.
on the positive side, some are by-passing college for well-paying jobs that do not require a college education or require specialized eduction such as the police academy or culinary school.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 2/18/2010 10:40:17 AM
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APZR
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Many aren't on campus because they are working and taking classes ON LINE!
The internet opened up tremendous opportunities for many "non-traditional students". There are also many who have chosen the armed forces and using opportunities there to take classes, mostly on line, while serving their duty. Relying on a head count on a physical college campus is inaccurate and irresponsible to use such data as a measurement. Our local tech school is packed to the brim with students, mostly men trying to learn a new trade. Not everyone can be an attorney, someone has to actually build things and make stuff. So you will see colleges stuck in the past in the name of "tradition" continue to see their enrollment numbers slip and look skewed.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 2/18/2010 11:01:06 AM
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stellaluna
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Online students are counted as part of the regular enrollment. You don't have to be sitting in a classroom to be part of the "head count."
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 2/18/2010 5:58:07 PM
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APZR
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quote:
ORIGINAL: stellaluna
Online students are counted as part of the regular enrollment. You don't have to be sitting in a classroom to be part of the "head count."
I question that because the premise of the article is "on campus attendance".
quote:
A visit to your local college or university campus is likely to reveal that a revolution has taken place. On many campuses, young women now outnumber young men, and a gender gap of momentous importance is staring us in the face.
_____________________________
Ya can't keep trouble from visitin, but you don't have to offer it a chair.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 2/18/2010 6:39:28 PM
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stellaluna
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This article just isn't clear. I work at a college and am familiar with the statistics, which refer to overall enrollment, not actual appearance on campus.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 2/18/2010 8:14:54 PM
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Auben
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Total fear-mongering.
More women are in college, but not INSTEAD of men. In terms of percentage of the population more men are attending college than there were in 1970 or 2000. The reason there are more women then men in college is because the number of women going to college has increased more in the last generation.
So this has nothing to do with feminized schools..yada yada. It has everything to do with the fact that this generation of women has been raised with the idea that you can't expect a man to take care of you all your life. It is expected that a woman will need to work at least some time in her lifetime and if she doesn't want a menial job she needs a college education.
Also, percentage-wise minorities have experienced more growth in college attendance than white males. Let's freak out about that too.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 2/19/2010 2:35:45 PM
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Consecrated2God
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I know in my school there are LOT of women that are going back to school. Like me, their husbands probably already went through college and they stayed home with the babies, and now the babies are getting older and it's our turn now. There are older men that are returning, too, but I think far more women that maybe missed the chance the first time around for whatever reason, and when you add all of them on top of the kids coming out of high school, it's very understandable why there are so many women in school now.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 3/5/2010 9:58:58 AM
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DaveW
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quote:
ORIGINAL: stellaluna
You need look no further than our own parenting/homeschool/public school folders to see some bizarre opinions that little boys simply aren't wired for school. Hmmm....they were wired for school for generations before this, and expected to sit still and learn using many of the same methods used today. Same methods - I would say not.
Readin' and writin' and 'rithmatic
taught to the tune of a hickory stick
When this method was banished in the 50s and 60s, girls started coming up in academic performance. And they guys started going down. It was a slow change to be sure but what we see now is the outcome of a couple of generations without corporal punishment in the classroom.
Boys are not wired for coddling. They are wired for harsh environments. If they do not find it in the classroom they will make one for themselves in the streets.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 3/5/2010 11:18:59 AM
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p31woman
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I've long been a believer in boys-only and girls-only schools. Both genders would (and do) fare better.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 3/5/2010 3:38:00 PM
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deermousie
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With the economy being as poor as it is right now, it could be the guys are being breadwinners instead of students, while the gals may be more supported by fathers and husbands. I'm guessing.
There's a young man in my church who goes to college every other year, and works construction in between to pay his way. He's almost got his contractor's license now.
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Read it. Eat it. Dwell in it. Rightly divide it. Live it.
Laugh, dance, praise your God, and go read some more. And God bless you.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 3/6/2010 5:37:58 AM
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rgod
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Consecrated2God
I know in my school there are LOT of women that are going back to school. Like me, their husbands probably already went through college and they stayed home with the babies, and now the babies are getting older and it's our turn now. There are older men that are returning, too, but I think far more women that maybe missed the chance the first time around for whatever reason, and when you add all of them on top of the kids coming out of high school, it's very understandable why there are so many women in school now.
Hmmm ... this is very interesting. Maybe if we look at the ages of the students who are in college and then look at the genders, we might find this to be true. I guess we need more statistical data.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 3/6/2010 5:42:11 AM
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rgod
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deermousie
With the economy being as poor as it is right now, it could be the guys are being breadwinners instead of students, while the gals may be more supported by fathers and husbands. I'm guessing.
Actually, I think it would be the opposite. Men have been more deeply impacted by the recession than women because it has hit the fields and work responsibilities that are often held by men the hardest (construction, middle-managers, auto-workers, etc.). Women are more apt to be lower paid or to work part-time so that they can take care of families. If an employer needs to save money and two people are doing the same job - but one is getting paid less (remember, women are paid on average 30% less than men), employers are opting to keep the cheaper employee - which means women are maintaining jobs.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 3/7/2010 8:55:36 AM
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Sideways
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quote:
ORIGINAL: DaveW
Boys are not wired for coddling. They are wired for harsh environments. If they do not find it in the classroom they will make one for themselves in the streets.
Oh that is total nonsense. You think in order for my son to learn I have to beat him whenever he steps out of line? You don't know my son at all. That would not work for him.
We'll have high expectations for both our son and daughter and there will be consequences for not performing to the best of their ability, but I totally disagree that the reason why boys are opting out of school is because they aren't getting beaten enough.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 3/7/2010 10:54:15 AM
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iknownothing
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rgod
quote:
ORIGINAL: deermousie
With the economy being as poor as it is right now, it could be the guys are being breadwinners instead of students, while the gals may be more supported by fathers and husbands. I'm guessing.
Actually, I think it would be the opposite. Men have been more deeply impacted by the recession than women because it has hit the fields and work responsibilities that are often held by men the hardest (construction, middle-managers, auto-workers, etc.). Women are more apt to be lower paid or to work part-time so that they can take care of families. If an employer needs to save money and two people are doing the same job - but one is getting paid less (remember, women are paid on average 30% less than men), employers are opting to keep the cheaper employee - which means women are maintaining jobs.
I think this is an excellent point. Except for the high-tech areas and computers, every major economic change in the past 150 years, beginning with industrialization, has hurt the mens' role in society and the workplace. After all, you don't see men on Amish farms sitting around despondent with nothing to do.
But I don't think we should ignore how the atmosphere has been totally feminized and radicalized on college campuses today, which makes them inhospitable to men (unless you are a football or basketball star).
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 3/7/2010 10:58:02 AM
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stellaluna
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quote:
ORIGINAL: iknownothing
But I don't think we should ignore how the atmosphere has been totally feminized and radicalized on college campuses today, which makes them inhospitable to men (unless you are a football or basketball star).
On what do you base your opinion?
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 3/7/2010 1:26:56 PM
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Sideways
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I'd say that real men are inspired by a little competition for that job/college slot; whiny boys sit around and complain about feminism. Seriously, wouldn't the world be so much easier for men if all females just stayed home, kept their mouths shut and did what they were told? But that genie is out of the bottle, and now males must prove that they are better qualified. Tough.
Besides, I went to a top-notch university in the late 90's, and 75% of the student body was male, so I don't think the sky is falling just yet.
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RE: Where Are the Young Men? - 3/7/2010 6:21:43 PM
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rgod
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Am I missing something here (please enlighten me if I am - I want to learn) - but wasn't the current college educational model designed by men? Isn't this, in essence, the same basic model that we've had for centuries when men were the ones with the access to education, not women? I'm confused, because I don't see how something that was designed by men, is now too feminine.
I'm not quite sure why the figures are as they are. I'm inclined to think that maybe some of it is about demographics as was said by Consecrated2God. If men tend to go to college first, and women put their mates through school while taking care of the family - then it would follow that when statistics on this were first being compiled (not sure how long this has been happening) that it would take into account the time when many women didn't have access to higher education (50s and before) and the baby boom generation. It seems that the "increase" in women's attendance might coincide with women going back to school at a later age (tail end of the boomer's generation) - coupled with the Gen X, Y, and beyond, where women and men are going to school at similar levels and rates. I think it is hard to tell though without more of a breakdown of figures - particularly by age ... and maybe region.
iknownothing - I don't think that I'd agree that industrialization has hurt men's role in society, since, as I said before, statistics show that men still overwhelmingly populate the line, mid, and upper management positions, and completely dominate the highest paying professions, such as engineering (civil, mechanical, electrical, and most of the others) and computer science. No matter what level, even when you factor in education levels and years in the profession, men generally make more than women, and this cuts across all but a very few professions according to the stats I've seen. Instead, what I think is happening is exactly what Friedman was arguing in his best-selling book "The World Is Flat" - that the people who feel the pinch of globalization in the US are those who have jobs that are either unskilled or semi-skilled, or that can be easily exported. This means that those that, for whatever reason, many who do not get higher education are suddenly competing against workers in other parts of the world because of globalization, improved transportation options, and technology. Companies sometimes retain women because they'll do the job at lower pay because they've always been doing the job at lower pay. And of course, the part of the country matters too. If you live in some parts of Florida or West Virginia where the cost of living is low, jobs are scarce and workers are plentiful, wages are low.
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